E-coli-gy
Okay, yet another blog posting on this darn topic. Sorry to weigh in so late, but I'm one of your classic absentee tenant-types; cottage at Sauble, winter residence here in St. Paul, Minnesota. The hot election issues take a while to sink in at this distance. But I've been reading SBP more lately and I'm fascinated at all this heat, both in the air and under the collar, about sewers and septics, water and Walkerton.
I'm just thinking, if we were all in a room together right now discussing this, here's the questions I would ask, and the order I would ask them in.
1. Septic systems are leaching. How many? Water supplies are threatened. How many? (Let's get a handle on how widespread this thing is first. No point applying a fifty-megaton solution if we only have a ten-pound problem.)
2. Are the systems that are leaching up to code? If they are, then maybe the code is broken, not the systems. And...
3. If the bad systems are not up to code ... then would fixing them be sufficient?
4. And here's the big one. Are we talking about a few aging components here and there in an otherwise fundamentally sound system of water & waste management? If so, you could presumably just fix the bad systems & things will be fine. Or are we really looking at a moment of reckoning, when the old system of septic tanks and wells at Sauble has finally outgrown capacity? In which case it's time for a wholesale change from individual systems to a centralized water & waste management system?
5. For either argument - what's your evidence?
6. Does anyone even have enough evidence to be conclusive about either point of view? If you do, where is it? If you don't, how are you going to get it?
7. Some anti-sewer and water pipe folks feel the expense of a whole new system is far too much for year-round residents to bear alone. They're almost certainly right. Where's the money going to come from, then? The county? The province? If not there ... is anyone working on bright fundraising ideas? Is there a committee?
8. Some anti-sewer and water pipe folks also feel that this water treatment thing is really the thin edge of a hidden wedge. They feel that, once a centralized water supply and sewage system is in place, waterfront property owners will jump to sell their lots to developers who will come in & wreck Sauble with large hotels & condos. What do the candidates have to say to these very real concerns? What could be done to prevent uncontrolled sprawl from wrecking an e.coli-free Sauble?
9. Last: Just because something happened in Walkerton does not mean "a Walkerton" is any more or less likely to happen anywhere else. Last time I looked, Walkerton happened because of civic mismanagement and poorly understood & operated equipment. That's simply not what's happening at Sauble. The seriousness of water/sewer management is not disputed by anyone in this conversation. But unless someone can point to a clear correlation between Walkerton's pre-e.coli behavior and equipment and Sauble's, then saying "Walkerton" over and over is just hyperbole.
None of this is said in anything except the spirit of friendly discussion. And if I've wedged my foot in my mouth as usual, I'd be grateful to anyone for pointing it out! I will admit that, at the moment, I'm a little skeptical of the need for a new water & sewer system at Sauble. But I have an open mind. I'm happy to hear other points of view.





Moments of Reckoning
You're not trying to incite riots in the streets there ptrob, are you? Cause one of the constants I've found as a relative newcomer is how this little village is one of the only places left on the planet where you can start a bar-fight with just one word: sewer
I dare say it is not as simple as your checklist, just for starters, and go as far to say that it is as many-sided as there are people to opine their sides upon it. In that sense then, yes, there is a seed in your taunt here if we take the physical-sciences definitions of your terms, a kinetic moment (pivot) of perceptual dead-reckonning where we are standing still in a collision of long-standing viewpoints that may be now under further stress of an influx of new viewpoints, and in that tension, in that tensor space all it will take is one small dis-equalibrium and the whole thing could snap, one way or the other. Personally, I think that would be a Bad Thing. I'd rather have a balance.
I'm one of the newcomers, as I've said, and one of the unusual viewpoints in that I am not opposed to development where development is appropriate nor am I opposed to ecological conservation where conservation is appropriate, but beyond those obvious talking points, I'm one of those pesky people who believes in the richness of the grey grounds in between.
For example, for a tangible example, take what you said about toxic septics: I am with you all the way on asking if the regulations are insufficient, and I have already posted here about the criminality of intentionally withholding information on the locations and numbers of these alledged deadly-broken septics. That much is, I would expect, common sense (if not simply a sense from common scents). I go farther than you in asking if the reason for said tanks may be a financial inability of the owner, and propose a general fund for interest-free loans to help these owners bring their tanks up to spec.
But I also recognize the need for more than just cottage-level water systems, the need for at least small-scale light-industrial capabilities and for modern urban capacities; just as the modern beachside dwelling expects several 3-prong 110volt electrical outlets in every room instead of the 'traditional' cottage wiring done with extension cords, modern life also now expects to run washing machines, take long hot showers and, of interest to many of our newer members here, our modern insurance really would rather we lived where emergency crews could pull hydrants of water out of the ground in case of fire. I can agree to all of that, in moderation of course, but I can see their point.
Only, what bugs me in these debates is the seeming non sequiteur that follows, going from the need for modern volumes of potable water to some need for a massive centralized water provision and reclamation, at a staggering cost that is as unfathomable in it's weight as the daily costs of that little war in Iraq. Clearly, I don't think like the average human, that should be clear enough.
You see, or rather, you've seen from reading those posts from the years going back here how there seems to be an almost neurotic addiction to that word 'sewer' -- there are, in this modern high-tech world, many water solutions, and more appearing all the time. It is a very, very common itch.
That is worth repeating: Municipal Water Management is a very common itch.
That means water management is a problem shared not just by Sauble and Wiarton and Hepworth, but by ever last municipality on the face of this good earth. Every last one of them. They all have this same problem, for the same reasons, for the same dreams, they all want clean water and they all have to flush.
Now, you don't have to be an economist or be packing an MBA to realize that when you have a need that is urgent and global, there is money to be made for them who have the nous to find means to scratch that itch. The inventor of membrane filtration came from a tiny village in China no bigger than Sauble Beach. New methods of filtration have reduced the cost per litre with simple innovations. And this is just one of many, many, many technological innovations which can be found in a few minutes sitting down with Google. Can you imagine what you might find if you sat down to seriously look at this itch-scratching issue?
We here in SBP have been handed a golden goose, and we want to sell it for someone's christmas dinner because, it seems, that's what everyone else does with geese. We see Walkerton's people die because of a single failure of a centralized control point and we want one too, because that's what everyone else does. We see Port Credit building huge monoliths to planned obsolescence and we want to pack our waterfront with condos too, because that's what everyone else does, and I'm not going to question something solely on the basis of the logical flaw of the Argument by Popularity, but I do have to stop and question these directions under the light of the simple observation that none of these 'everyone else' places is reaping any real long-term benefits from these roads most taken, and that concerns me. But then, we've already ascertained that I don't really think much like most people, so you can take all that with a grain or two.
But here's the thing. Here's the moment, the point of the balance of the watch-ticking armature, sitting at that teetering point where just one little nudge and there it goes, tumbling dice, dominoes and butterfly-effects and maybe, just maybe some flash of insight and some realization and some change in the wind that leaves 'sewer' as just another word. It could happen. It could happen and it could be triggered by something very simple, an idea, an act of leadership ...
... or even a blog post.
just one thought about it all
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"Did A.J.Krapper organize a mass walk-out of latrines?"
-zenGary
Fire Hydrants Are Not A Cure For Fires
I had to re read Gary's post to understand yours Bub. As long as you broached the subject: Planning for future fire services in the whole of the municipality will not now include hydrants in Hepworth or all of Sauble Beach. While hydrants were often used to justify part of the cost of the Wiarton pipeline I am not so sure that life without them results in a different outcome for the typical dwelling fire.
I live in a city with a full time fire dept. They figure here if they don't respond to a site within 8 minutes the house is fully involved. Standard response time is probably slower with a volunteer fire crew. The presence of hydrants doesn't change that.
At Sauble most of the cottages are frame construction. They can go fast. Hydrants make things easier for firefighters if they are present but they well know how to work without them.
You leave a pail of hot ash on your deck on a windy day and then go to work your house is toast. Fire hydrants are not a cure for fires. You live a few kilometers from the hall and you pay a small premium on your insurance. Thats the way we live.
Rather than hydrants, improvements in equipment and hall locations are probably more productive for the greater municipality The second COMRIF application for pipeline funding was a cut down system. It did not include fire hydrants because of the cost of a water storage facility.
The Amabel- Sauble System which will combine 7 small systems at Sauble does include 39 hydrants but requires extensive storage to meet fire fighting and regular water supply requirements. This system will be expensive and be ready for construction next year and there will be a high monetary cost to each of the properties.
The ability to use ground water supply at Huron Woods and the Sauble School wells is a possible indicator that a source could be found to supply the downtown core area for those that want to pay for a water system.
A few areas will have hydrants yes but my point is the ultimate outcome is conditional on the training and equipment and the distance and response times. The pipeline is history. We now know we won't have fire hydrants in Hepworth and covering all of Sauble Beach. We can live without them just as other areas of the Town do.
Pipe line
Dodge...although I would like to agree with you that the pipeline is history, methinks you are sounding a tad like Noble in your cavalier denial of its possibility. His views allowed him to ascertain what he thought was the obvious installation of sewers and water. Yours forsee the demise of said system. Always remember that a promise made is seldom a promise kept when walking through the minefields of municipal politics. I doubt we have heard the last from Powerbutt and
igNoble and their lobby group of developers. While there is definitely a pail of hot ash left over from the previous regime, we must always be wary of the phoenix and the strong winds that blow at our doorstep. Allowing our guard to drop would only allow these winds to fan the fire.
a view from over the hill
Just catching up on some of the blogs and notes...a few comments and personal opinions: for the whiners who are complaining about where the money would come from for a new system for the core area....Probably going to be much easier to round up money for the small stand alone than for the umbilical/intestinal pipeline from Willy's toilet! Has anyone actually tasted the water (bleaching laxitive) from Willy?...Scooping up Mark's DNA from the old Beachcomber (sic) would probably taste better!
Was reading Noble's ad in the Sauble Bulletin (Nov-page 10)....reads like a high school resume....for 16 years of municipal service, just exactly what has this servant done? Remove the fluff and it leaves you with an empty half page...voters get recognition for donating 'new blood' into the council!.....There were a few close votes in the Wards.....anybody contesting the counts?...if I were to lose by one vote, I would certainly be looking at a recount!!!...was talking to one of the poop suckers this summer.....he sees the sins and spillage....why don't we pay these people to help in the inspection system...conflict of interest could probably be outweighed by $tinking dollars and they certainly know who the culprits are!!!(just fantasizing)...looks like we will be seeing almost as much of Fulford at council as we have in the past!!!later, eh!
can we arrange sumpin?
say..you stay at my place for a few months and I can stay in beverly hills at the same time?? :D
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"Did A.J.Krapper organize a mass walk-out of latrines?"
-zenGary